tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post3673690721765058980..comments2024-03-06T02:46:19.929+00:00Comments on Translation Tribulations: How low can you go?Kevin Lossnerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14727800526216764023noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-25559105688081520432009-09-13T07:29:49.504+01:002009-09-13T07:29:49.504+01:00Really interesting stuff Kevin - and I'm right...Really interesting stuff Kevin - and I'm right with you on the ProZ issue. I was asked to moderate recently but it's not a gig for me (I can see why now). I was usually the kid getting caned by the principal, not the one giving the caning! Still, like you said, the small amount of good stuff does balance the negative stuff and corporate nonsense.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-75084253172955398702009-09-07T13:45:58.733+01:002009-09-07T13:45:58.733+01:00@Ben: You're right, of course. "Unpaid&qu...@Ben: You're right, of course. "Unpaid" is a poor choice of words. What I meant was that I am not responsible for your staff salaries as I am for my partner's assistant or others in the past. I have the pleasure of your service as a project manager, reviewer, etc., and you do me the favor of handling the collections from the end customer and getting my questions answered. In the years we have worked together, your team has always done its part, making your shop a textbook example of how I think a good small agency should operate.<br /><br />As for the salaried staff for end customers handling translations, the quality of those relations depend on many factors. If the boss's speech at the next trade show needs translating, in most cases it works out perfectly well for her secretary to skip the middleman and go directly to a good freelance translator. However, I think there are far too many cases where the clients don't know what good is or don't have time to handle screening or are simply not capable of managing complex projects effectively (here I am thinking of a direct client who insists on disastrous management of 20+ languages in Excel sheets, all handled by a young monolingual purchasing agent - oh yes, with lots of DTP formats as targets too). In these cases a good agency is a godsend to a company.<br /><br />The most effective direct client relations I see are where there are trained, dedicated staff acting as an "internal agency". These people are particularly good at responding to terminology issues and extracting needed information from the departments that send them translation requests. I have several direct clients like this, and I love them, would welcome more in fact. But from a workflow standpoint, there is little to distinguish them from an external agency like yours.<br /><br />What I do not particularly like is what you and I would probably refer to as "Umtüter", those who simply act as intermediaries but have no QA value to add. If the project management is still good and answers are obtained quickly when I have questions I don't mind really, but there are some who think passing on questions will make them look less competent, and they send me "helpful" little hints that are seldom of use in the hopes that the questions will go away. In the end that just delays matters or forces me to deliver what I consider to be an unfinished translation with a list of "issues".<br /><br />With the average direct client (company), there is often a lot of education effort involved, particularly at the beginning of a relationship. If the projects are one-off jobs, it is often doubtful that the higher rates cover the additional effort. I might need an hour to explain to a graphic artist how I can work directly with his DTP format if he handles certain preparation steps properly. Then I might have to spend another hour explaining it to his boss. When this goes on all the time, a 50 to 100% premium quickly works out to something close to the rate I would charge an agency which handles those conversations for me. The real solution, of course, is to charge a consulting fee for the time spent in explanation and preparation, because the client can benefit from that knowledge when working with any language service provider.Kevin Lossnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14727800526216764023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-86673807216024879722009-09-07T12:26:06.524+01:002009-09-07T12:26:06.524+01:00@Kevin:
"the bulk of my business continues to...@Kevin:<br /><i>"the bulk of my business continues to run via agencies (because I have limited time and patience for PM tasks - I think of them as my <b>unpaid</b> staff who shield me most of the time so I can get the real work done"</i><br />(Emphasis added by me)<br /><br />We're not unpaid, really. In point of fact, the lower rates you charge us in contrast to your direct clients basically comprise a salary for our efforts to make your work easier and ensure a smooth project flow. <br /><br />I wish every translator realized this. Then maybe translators would understand it's not worth paying salaries to people whose services are less than satisfactory and, conversely, that using a good agency can be a sound investment (which seems to be your stated preference.)<br /><br />All the best,<br />BenBenjaminhttp://www.tectranslate.denoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-45295532037588579922009-09-07T10:30:14.184+01:002009-09-07T10:30:14.184+01:00@Chris: "Danke für die Blumen" as the Ge...@Chris: "Danke für die Blumen" as the German's say. Your "organ grinder / monkey" comment is certainly applicable in many cases, though not all. It depends a lot on the qualifications of the agency PM one works with and the agency's approach to projects. One customer of mine in DDorf has a brilliant lady engineer as a PM who understands far more about the source documents than the monkeys (usually at Siemens) who wrote them. I'll prefer to work with someone like her any day: what is important to me is a well-managed project.<br /><br />Realistically, however, although the bulk of my business continues to run via agencies (because I have limited time and patience for PM tasks - I think of them as my unpaid staff who shield me most of the time so I can get the real work done), quite honestly most of the individual jobs really don't need an agency in any way. A good agency is useful when you are dealing with multilingual projects involving complexity for which there is no in-house competence. Some of my agencies do this rather well, and when some prospect calls with a brochure that needs to be translated from German to English and from there into 14 languages, I try to steer the inquiry to one of my partners who can handle that well. Like you, I'm really not interested in stepping in the subcontracting cow patty. (All those who bombard me every week with offers of cheap translation services, please take note of that. I don't subcontract, and if I were to do so, I would not look for cheap, I would look for good. If I don't know your work intimately, you are not on the list for subcontracting or recommendations and never will be. If I haven't mastered your language, I will never know your work.) <br /><br />Definitions of "urgent" are quite variable, and I am often pleased by what direct clients consider urgent. A few pages by the end of the following week is often offered apologetically as if such a short deadline were an imposition. Despite our awful workload, we can generally accommodate such requests. If there really is an urgent overnight need, it is usually well justified. With some agencies I often have the impression that the deadlines are set more as a matter of racing the competition, not because the customer really needs the document by the stated deadline. Or the PM doesn't do a really good job of finding out the customer's schedule. I've lost track of the number of times that I have sent clarification requests only to find out that the end customer will be back from vacation two weeks after the job is due. That is not amusing.Kevin Lossnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14727800526216764023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-27704718500099326452009-09-07T10:00:17.971+01:002009-09-07T10:00:17.971+01:00Hi Kevin,
Good stuff, as ever.
To me, the direct...Hi Kevin,<br /><br />Good stuff, as ever.<br /><br />To me, the direct client scenario is brilliant because, as you suggest, you are "talking to the organ-grinder and not to the monkey". Questions can be clarified virtually instantaneously and <b>both parties</b> benefit.<br /><br />The other thing is that once you have developed a good friendly working relationship and they say "it's urgent", you can ask "why"?<br /><br />If they need something for a meeting tomorrow, then fine. If it's for a meeting later next week, then it will be done in good time.<br /><br />I have one case where I think I have in fact got them trained up now, as they will say "It's urgent because..."<br /><br />These guys prefer to stick with me because of the experience and knowledge we have gathered together and if I am away, they use an agency as a default. I charge them what I deem to be a <b>realistic</b> rate for both parties (and low it ain't), but I have now found what the agency charges them.<br /><br />Cheers,<br />ChrisChris Irwinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20155610.post-81323568034899198892009-09-06T14:58:12.249+01:002009-09-06T14:58:12.249+01:00Thank you, Kevin, for such an interesting article....Thank you, Kevin, for such an interesting article. It is good to read how other (way more experienced) colleagues cope with this kind of situations.<br />Have a great day!Romina Berardihttp://www.rblanguageservices.com.arnoreply@blogger.com